BMW R1200RT/R1250RT forum

BMW R 1200RT => General Discussions => Topic started by: laughingboy on 2015-03-09 17:02:43

Title: Fuel grade
Post by: laughingboy on 2015-03-09 17:02:43
Just wondering which grade most of you use? Being new to the RT and reading the label around the tank lid saying to use RON 98, I'd like your opinions. There's probably been discussions on this before but I haven't managed to come across any yet. Previously I've used the lower grade in all my sports bikes.

My lad uses an RT doing voluntary blood donor work and he just puts the lower grade in that as that's what they told him they all tend to use. Welcome your feedback.

Chris   
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: RTman10 on 2015-03-09 17:25:09
When I had one I always used 98 believing they ran more smoothly. Many told me it made no difference.  The LC runs on 95.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: richardbd on 2015-03-09 17:48:00
I tend to mix it up - not really sure why because I'm not really sure it makes any difference.


My Multistrada was really sensitive to poor fuel, the RT seems happy with whatever it's given...

Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2015-03-09 17:58:57
The recommended fuel grade is 98 RON, using a lower Octane fuel may result in "power and consumption related restrictions", probably not noticeable.

The Bike's Engine Management System will adapt itself to the fuel used.

When possible, I always use the higher Octane stuff, obviously it's more expensive.

As the Blood Bike is a Charity, they may use the cheaper low Octane fuel to save a few pennies.

Sports bikes are likely to have a lower compression ratio than the RT, hence the lower Octane fuel required.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: laughingboy on 2015-03-09 18:23:03
Thanks for that info Dayglodavid, taken note. Will fill with the higher grade.

Had a slight miss fire and stutter on the first ride out and also the fuel gauge went pear shaped. Robsons (Dealer at York ) replaced the gauge and thought the stutter could be down to old fuel as the previous owner hadn't ridden much in the past few years and the fuel would've been in a while. They checked it over again for me and all seemed okay on todays ride. I was quite impressed with Barrie Robson as he listened to my comments, came out and had the bike running and when it changed note, he got the mechanic out to check it over as he said it wasn't quite right! They gave it a check over when they changed the fuel gauge, which I understand is a common fault with the older RTs.

Thanks again,

Chris
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: RTman10 on 2015-03-09 18:46:55
You are correct about fuel reading errors.  It is in fact the actual sensor in the tank that packs up. New replacement ones seem OK.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: stelyn on 2015-03-09 22:51:25
The recommended fuel grade is 98 RON, using a lower Octane fuel may result in "power and consumption related restrictions",

Is there really  any `evidential advantage' in using  RON 98 octane ( PREMIUM )  fuel as recommended by BMW,   the Bikes seem to run fine on the 95 ?  -  is it  long term better for the system / more mileage / or better performance and smooth running,   or just more costly at the `Pump'  ?      Personally have so far  filled with the 95, and the RT  runs fine and responsive,  what  are you using ? ....... :whistle:
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2015-03-10 00:13:22
The quote "power and consumption related restrictions", was taken out of the BMW Rider's Manual, their words not mine.

I use the "Full Fat" stuff when it's available.

VBH says, https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WTaBngvsPrc

Fifth Gear say, https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gQghB4asSnI
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: stelyn on 2015-03-10 09:51:14
Hi David.   Think I'll try the `premium' on the next few `re-fills'   then, to see if there's a difference in  performance ect, thanks for the `info'   ( useful stuff again  )     :)
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Pope on 2015-03-23 10:46:18
I run both my Ducati and RTLC on cheep basic supermarket unleaded.


I've experimented with the premium grades like Shell Vmax etc.. but i really cant see/feel any tangible benefit.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Levisp on 2015-03-23 17:24:43
I run both my Ducati and RTLC on cheep basic supermarket unleaded.


I've experimented with the premium grades like Shell Vmax etc.. but i really cant see/feel any tangible benefit.


Agree I too can see no performance benefit. However it may result in a cleaner engine, less carbon deposit but as you cannot see that I'll presume its all hype. I'm sticking with the cheapest unleaded I can find.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: CMB123 on 2015-03-24 04:38:08
I always use the high octane myself for performance and longevity, which may or may not be true. Also petrol, aka gas on the west coast, sells for about 40 pence a litre. Oh, and the folks here think we are being gouged at this price :-)
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Budman on 2015-03-24 16:33:29
So, if my calculations are correct you are paying the equivalent of $2.22  per US gallon. At home I'm paying $2.49 for premium and  $2.19 for regular.


To get ethanol free gasoline it will cost about 30 cents more per gallon.


Bud
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Levisp on 2015-03-24 18:02:54
I always use the high octane myself for performance and longevity, which may or may not be true. Also petrol, aka gas on the west coast, sells for about 40 pence a litre. Oh, and the folks here think we are being gouged at this price :-)


40 pence a litre ! My last fill up yesterday was £1.09 a litre. Think I prefer your price :)
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: CMB123 on 2015-03-25 05:22:07
Hi Budman- good math...I actually buy across the line in Washington State. I live on the line so the US gas station is closer and I have Nexus so I can breeze through the border crossing (Blane/Peace Arch). In Canada it's more than the U.S., I'm saving about 40 cents a litre by crossing the line! That's about forty bucks when I fill my F350 :-)
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Steveeung on 2015-04-21 20:53:41
The manual for the LC says Superunleaded RON 95. I thought Super Unleaded was RON 98?
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: RTman10 on 2015-04-21 22:00:42
Think 98 is Premium Unleaded. That's what pre LCs are supposed to need.   
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Steveeung on 2015-04-21 22:11:08
See attached from the manual - still confused :wonder:
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: RTman10 on 2015-04-22 08:38:08
About what? 95 is Super unleaded.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Steveeung on 2015-04-22 09:52:57
Apologies I'm an idiot - my brain did not distinguish between 'super' and 'premium'    :not speak:
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Spencert231 on 2015-04-23 09:20:25
I was using the best, but have reverted to 95 been on it a while now and no change in engine performance.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Steveeung on 2015-04-23 09:39:09
Thanks to all   ^-^
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2015-07-21 13:18:08
Whilst in Germany recently, there was 3 grades of fuel available, Super, Super E10 (both 95) & Super Plus (98).

(http://i764.photobucket.com/albums/xx283/Dackelone/IMG_1592.jpg)

The recommended fuel grade for my 2012 Twin Cam is 98, an alternative is 95 as per The Rider's Manual.

Super E10 was the cheapest at the pump, but I wasn't sure what it was, having not seen it before in the UK.

The LC Rider's Manual & some research has enlightened me, E10 is 10% Ethanol, (not full fat fuel),looks like it is more environmentally friendly with less emissions.

(/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1252.0;attach=1371;image)
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2016-08-05 11:32:48
Oh no, just noticed that my 2012 TC Rider's Manual says that BMW recommends BP fuels, another reason to throw out a warranty claim as I usually use Tesco fuel.

http://www.simplemotoring.co.uk/supermarket-vs-branded-fuels/#.V6ReV2f6t9A

"There are all sorts of stories that go round about supermarket fuels, but the fact is that supermarket fuel tanker lorries are often seen filling up from the same tanks as branded fuel lorries (e.g. Shell, BP) – so the chances are that most of the time, the fuel they sell is the same, although again, it may have different additives packages."
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: RTman10 on 2016-08-05 13:08:56
Think the 10 relates to ethanol content.  Don't think it's a problem in BMWs.  I always use Tesco fuel as I'm addicted to Tesco points.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2016-08-05 13:29:29
Super E10 was the cheapest at the pump, but I wasn't sure what it was, having not seen it before in the UK.

The LC Rider's Manual & some research has enlightened me, E10 is 10% Ethanol, (not full fat fuel),  looks like it is more environmentally friendly with less emissions.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Mike on 2016-08-05 13:54:01
I've noticed better performance with higher grade when two up with luggage
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2016-08-05 18:46:17
This article may make interesting reading about Ethanol in fuel, http://www.groups.tr-register.co.uk/wessex/ethanol-update.html
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2020-03-09 13:49:12
From what I can gather, unleaded fuel was first introduced to the UK in 1986. As far as I know, irrespective of the octane rating, it's always been permissible for it to contain up to 5% Ethanol (E5). With the prospect of 10% Ethanol (E10) fuel becoming available in the UK, thought I'd do some research.

There are lots of articles out there, here is one from Wemoto, https://www.wemoto.com/news/article/1244/10_ethanol_petrol_is_on_its_way_to_the_u

In my 2012 TC Rider's Manual, it just says use unleaded fuel, no mention of Ethanol content. Hopefully, up to 5% (E5) is acceptable. If and when E10 is the norm in the UK, it looks like the higher octane fuels will continue to have a maximum of 5% (E5).

I also have a 1980 Yamaha XJ650. Obviously manufactured prior to unleaded fuel being available in the UK. I remember being concerned about running it on unleaded. It was pointed out to me that unleaded fuel was first used in Japan in 1972, therefore, bikes were manufactured to run on it. Yamaha UK also confirmed this to be the case.

Going forward, perhaps the best thing to do is use the highest octane rated fuel available for both bikes. The TC RT should have 98 RON any way, although 95 RON can be used. Presumably, if the latter 95 RON ends up with 10% Ethanol (E10),  it should not be used. With the Yamaha, it used to run on 2* leaded fuel (87 octane),  less than the current standard UL at 95 octane. The recommended octane ratings are usually minimums, not maximums.

Looking back at this thread, I may have used E10 once in the RT whilst in Germany.

How about a discussion on fuel, rather than oil or tyres for a change!
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2020-03-09 14:24:34
To add "fuel" to the debate, BMW recommends BP fuels for my 2012 TC.

This was posted in the Low MPG thread, /index.php?topic=3561.0

"Have done a comparison between Tesco & BP fuel over the same 100 miles with the cruise control set at 70 MPH (Sat. Nav.).
Returned 59.9 MPG & 64.6 MPG respectively, using the physical full to full method."


From what I have read, BP Ultimate does not contain Ethanol, whereas Tesco Momentum does.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: bandytales on 2020-03-09 16:41:15
Maybe i'm a cheapskate, but I run my bike on the cheapest fuel I can get (in the UK!). The bike has NEVER baulked. The performance is spot on and I am averaging over 60 (UK) MPG. I have always run my bike on the cheap stuff unless it wasn't available (or if the boss was paying for it). However as the amount of Ethanol added increases, I may change my tune, if the bikes' performance suffers.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2020-03-09 19:08:41
95 RON is the "Standard" UL petrol in the UK. LC's will run on it, including up to 10% (E10) Ethanol content.

What do pre-LC owners think, plus anyone who has an older bike or car.

Cars manufactured post 2011 are made to run on up to 10% Ethanol fuel.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: simbo on 2020-03-09 20:46:16
Tesco's cheap stuff, spend £60 in store an get an extra 5p per litre off.  8) 
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Sprintgull on 2020-03-10 10:50:17
I've noticed that UK pumps have E5 or E10 on the label.  I usually stick in 98RON for the first fill if the bike has been stood for a while, then just use standard 95RON.  Works fine.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2020-03-10 11:01:08
I've noticed that UK pumps have E5 or E10 on the label.

Looks like they were introduced in September 2019, https://www.theaa.com/driving-advice/fuels-environment/new-labels-on-petrol-and-diesel-pumps-2019

Is E10 already available in the UK.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: bandytales on 2020-03-10 13:46:14
I've noticed that UK pumps have E5 or E10 on the label.  I usually stick in 98RON for the first fill if the bike has been stood for a while, then just use standard 95RON.  Works fine.


Now we are starting to see more Ethanol in fuel, we might need to start monitoring any immersed fuel hoses. Our US colleagues have been finding that Ethanol has deteriorated fuel hoses and seals on older bikes. The R11XX were having issues with hoses splitting whereas the UK guys were not experiencing this to anywhere near the same levels. However, with the dreaded Ethanol percentage creeping in (and up) we are likely to find a similar issue. You may also notice a slight drop off in performance that may be mitigated by moving to the higher RON number if you feel it is effecting you.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2020-03-10 16:04:10
I'm not aware that using a fuel of a higher octane rating than that recommended will burn a hole in anything other than your wallet.

It would seem that, if & when E10 becomes widely available in the UK, E5 will have to be offered as an alternative at the pumps.

The higher octane rated fuels will have less or no Ethanol content compared to that of the lower octane fuels.

Based on the fact that the pre-LC RT's will run better on the "full fat" stuff, I'll use it for my 2012 TC RT.

Likewise with the 1980 XJ650, it may have been designed to run on 2* leaded or unleaded, but surely not E10 UL.

Paying more at the pumps may result in paying less at the workshop.

This document, https://www.acem.eu/component/content/article/2-non-categorise/33-e10 would suggest that since the introduction of E10 in 2011, all BMW Motorrad models are compatible with E10. However the number of octanes needs to be compatible with the model according to user handbook.

All Yamaha models from Model Year 1990 are compatible with E10, therefore, the XJ650 isn't.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: MEM62 on 2020-03-11 11:14:13
I never run a comparison the my 2012 1200RT.  The manual recommends 98 octane and that what it gets - usually a banded fuel as I like my bike too much to put supermarket fuels in it.  However, over the last 20,000 mile or so my 320i has average 39mpg on 98 octane fuel and somewhere in the region of 43 mpg on 95.     
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2020-03-11 14:38:54
Within a 2 miles radius of home, there is a choice of 3 filling stations, Tesco, Shell or Esso.

Both Tesco Momentum 99 & Shell V-Power 99 are the same octane rating. I believe that they both contain up to 5% Ethanol.

The highest UL grade Esso offer is Supreme+ at 97.
"There is currently no requirement for renewable fuel (such as ethanol) to be present in super unleaded (97 grade petrol)."

"Esso super unleaded petrol (Synergy Supreme+ Unleaded 97) is ethanol free (except in Devon, Cornwall, the Teesside area and Scotland). We would therefore advise anyone who has concerns about the presence of ethanol in petrol to use Synergy Supreme+ – providing they do not fill up in Devon or Cornwall, the Teesside area or Scotland."

Since I live in the Teesside area, there is no point in buying Esso.

If BP Ultimate doesn't contain Ethanol, I'd have to travel twice as far to get it and it's not usually on my way home from a ride out when I like to fill up ready for next time out.

Looks like there is nothing much to choose between Tesco & Shell, therefore I'll stick to Tesco Momentum 99.

Tesco say, "Momentum 99 contains a special blend of additives to help keep the fuel system clean and working at its best."

Shell claim lots of improvements but don't guarantee them, https://www.shell.co.uk/motorist/shell-fuels/shell-v-power/shell-v-power-unleaded.html
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2020-03-11 15:54:39
If BP Ultimate doesn't contain Ethanol.

Looks like BP may also indeed contain Ethanol, https://www.bp.com/en_gb/united-kingdom/home/products-and-services/bp-ultimate-fuels/european-biofuels-labelling-faqs.html#accordion_My

"Both BP Ultimate unleaded and BP regular unleaded may contain up to 5% bioethanol so are fine to use in your vehicle."

If it's got Ethanol in it, the pump/nozzle should be marked as so. Perhaps some field testing is required and results posted here.

Having said that, the labelling is a maximum, not a minimum or zero Ethanol content. It's anybody's guess!
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2020-03-11 22:29:55
Found this posted on the Kawasaki 1400 GTR Forum.

"Petrol is petrol though the RON does vary. I make the stuff for a living, the same petrol goes into road tankers from; Tesco, Morrisons, Shell, BP, Asda and Texaco the only difference is the additives they squirt into it."

The "additives" bit seems to be a big secret!
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2021-08-22 08:09:33
Noticed for the first time yesterday that E10 is now being displayed at the pumps. In the UK, where there is a choice of two octane rated UL fuels, the lower one is now E10, whilst the higher is still E5. I'll continue to use the "full fat" higher octane E5 fuel in both my bikes. Although not stated in the Rider's Manual, I believe it is acceptable to run a Camhead on E10 fuel.

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/104126/e10-petrol-explained-uk-prices-checker-tool-and-it-ok-your-car
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: jackronner on 2021-08-22 09:08:47
$2.49 per US gallon??   Try living in California.  Most name brands are around $5/gallon!!  And the top octane is only 91.  The state mandates many expensives additives that drive the price up and, since it probably has to be "brewed" here, when one refinery goes down, the price goes up.  When I go cross-country I'm grinning like a fool at the lower prices.  Used to be 25 cents for premium when I was growing up in the US.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: sakm on 2021-08-22 10:30:11
There is a lot of people worrying about E10 and god knows why!


E5 will continue to be available in super unleaded form


The only stipulation with me is that I don't use supermarket fuels! I noticed years ago that my cars MPG was significantly lower when using Tesco fuel


There is a bit of a write up here if it helps anyone
https://themotorbikeforum.co.uk/topic/38453-e10-fuel-in-motorbikes/?tab=comments#comment-558429
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2021-08-22 11:03:51
When it comes to MPG, I'd agree that Tesco vs BP gives less MPG. As previously posted, a test on my RT gave 5 MPG better with BP vs Tesco.

However, at what cost, most recently, Tesco was 20p/litre cheaper than BP at a motorway service area.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: sakm on 2021-08-22 11:25:04
When it comes to MPG, I'd agree that Tesco vs BP gives less MPG. As previously posted, a test on my RT gave 5 MPG better with BP vs Tesco.

However, at what cost, most recently, Tesco was 20p/litre cheaper than BP at a motorway service area.


I totally agree with what you are saying and I have said it for years that any gains in MPG on any fuel is usually written off due to the price difference


As posted earlier in the thread fuel is fuel its all the same but its the additives that make the difference I just can't help but think what people like Tesco are putting in fuel to make you get a lower MPG compared to others.


It would be interesting to know what additives are in different fuels and what affects these additives can have on a bike


I think its just my paranoid head but I would rather avoid it to be honest
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2021-08-22 11:33:49
Fuel could be the new tyres/oils thread.

From what I've "Googled", the additives seem to be a top secret cocktail mix to improve MPG which clearly works. Other claims about engine cleanliness seem a bit OTT. When was the last time you decoked a 4 stroke engine. Then there is the supposedly environmental impact.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: sakm on 2021-08-22 11:50:57
 :)) :))


I can just see it now


What is the stickiest fuel  :))
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: sakm on 2021-08-22 12:07:33

From what I've "Googled", the additives seem to be a top secret cocktail mix to improve MPG which clearly works. Other claims about engine cleanliness seem a bit OTT. When was the last time you decoked a 4 stroke engine. Then there is the supposedly environmental impact.


Thats interesting you have just said that!


What if the additives do improve MPG and Tesco's is not "bad" fuel but better than what goes in the tanker anyway and others are just better than Tesco's


Without the additives the MPG may well be worse still


Its something we will never know really
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2021-08-22 12:17:16
Found this posted on the Kawasaki 1400 GTR Forum.

"Petrol is petrol though the RON does vary. I make the stuff for a living, the same petrol goes into road tankers from; Tesco, Morrisons, Shell, BP, Asda and Texaco the only difference is the additives they squirt into it."

The "additives" bit seems to be a big secret!

I don't think we'll ever find the answer. Bit like tyres/oils, you pays your money and makes your choice. Whatever makes you feel good, it's all in the mind!
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: knuckplucker on 2021-11-22 04:14:52
I generally prefer to use premium fuel in my 2018 R1200 RTP (Ex  Australian Police). But I have come across the VIN information for my bike which tells me that it has "Specification 0639 - Provisions F Regular Fuel Unleaded".


I assume that this means that I am able to run 91 in the bike if necessary (still like to use the 95),but can't find anywhere to confirm that assumption.


Any thoughts from the brains trust?
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2021-11-22 09:55:14
I assume that this means that I am able to run 91 in the bike if necessary (still like to use the 95),  but can't find anywhere to confirm that assumption.

Found this in a Rider's Manual.

Recommended fuel grade - Super unleaded (max. 10 % ethanol, E10) 95 ROZ/RON 89 AKI

Alternative fuel grade - Regular unleaded (Power and consumption related restrictions. If e.g. the engine is to be operated in countries with low fuel grades at 91 research octane number, then the motorcycle must first be programmed appropriately at your authorised BMW motorcycle dealer.) 91 ROZ/RON 87 AKI
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2021-11-22 11:42:44
More info. from BMWMOA, Reg. gas for an RT? (bmwmoa.org) (https://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?92541-Reg-gas-for-an-RT)

Reply #8 says, "There is NO knock sensor on a wethead motor".

If this is the case, that'll be why the engine needs re-programming.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: redcomet on 2021-11-22 13:02:20
From the Esso uk website:
Our Synergy Supreme+ 99 petrol has more cleaning power than our regular petrol – and includes molecules whose job it is to reduce the friction in your engine helping the moving parts work more efficiently.*Although our pumps have E5 labels on them, our Synergy Supreme+ 99 is actually ethanol free (except, due to technical supply reasons, in Devon, Cornwall, North Wales, North England and Scotland). Legislation requires us to place these E5 labels on pumps that dispense unleaded petrol with ‘up to 5% ethanol’, including those that contain no ethanol, which is why we display them on our Synergy Supreme+ 99 pumps.
There’s currently no requirement for renewable fuel, like ethanol, to be present in super unleaded petrol although this could change in the future, in which case we would comply with any new legislation.
Best wishes,
Pete


 
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: beemerboy9 on 2021-11-22 16:48:42
More info. from BMWMOA, Reg. gas for an RT? (bmwmoa.org) (https://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?92541-Reg-gas-for-an-RT)

Reply #8 says, "There is NO knock sensor on a wethead motor".

If this is the case, that'll be why the engine needs re-programming.


BMW say the 1250 Boxer does have a Knock Sensor. It has to because some of the places GS's are ridden have poor petrol. No knock sensor, no go.


That was not true of the LC 1200 where you could reprogram the GS ECU to use low-grade fuel. I can't imagine that was a popular move.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2021-11-22 17:12:15
Further research agrees with you John.

Looking at the MAX BMW Motorcycle parts fiche, RT Hexheads, Camheads & Shiftheads (1250) all have the same Ping (Knock) Sensor fitted, whereas for some reason, the Wethead (1200) doesn't. The bike in question is a 2018 Wethead (1200).

I suppose having the Wethead (1200) re-programmed to run on 91 RON, then using the higher 95 RON will be OK.

To the best of my knowledge, running an engine on a fuel of higher octane rating will only burn a hole in your wallet and not the engine. My 1980 Yamaha XJ650 was designed to run on leaded 87 RON 2*, it now gets treated to unleaded 99 RON Momentum E5 from Tesco, plus STA-BIL 360 Protection. (Compression ratio 9.2:1)

I like what the FBHVC have to say, Fuels | Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs (fbhvc.co.uk) (https://fbhvc.co.uk/fuels#other)
"It is now generally accepted that while ‘excessive’ octane quality might be a waste of money, it is not harmful in low compression engines".
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Steve398 on 2021-12-03 15:18:55
My personal choice is rather dependent on how close to payday it is, especially now with the price of fuel overall. Generally it’s high octane supermarket fuel to try and get the best of both worlds…
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Old Foxy on 2021-12-03 18:49:53
+1 on Steve, although I found a BP station that was actually cheaper than the nearby supermarket! It pays to shop around, clearly.


Old Foxy
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2021-12-03 18:54:55
I found a BP station that was actually cheaper than the nearby supermarket!

Supermarkets seem to be taking the pi$$ at the moment, Retailers make shocking petrol profit, says RAC - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59508286)

"In particular, the RAC pointed the finger at supermarket chains who are major fuel retailers, such as Asda, Sainsbury's, Tesco and Morrisons, saying they should have reduced prices, but had instead increased them "unnecessarily"."
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Levisp on 2021-12-03 21:42:51
Yes I read that article. However surely they buy fuel in advance so when oil prices fall it takes time before that filters down to reduced fuel prices. Like all stories on the BBC you don't get the full picture. I wouldn't believe all you read. However they could be trying to claw back sales they lost when we were all in lockdown. Personally I shop around and buy the cheapest. On the question of fuel grade it's true the premium bands are only different by the additives they add. The basic petrol is all the same. So it's true to say a brand with cleaning additives will keep the upper cylinder head cleaner in the longterm, but for most people they would have traded in their bike long before seeing any benefit. As far as I can see only riders who ride mega miles 20k/year and keep their bikes for a very long time 10+ years will benefit. For must it's a con.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: David. on 2021-12-04 10:22:18
Does anyone use a fuel price comparison site, if so which one and would you recommend it.
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: jjwill on 2021-12-04 12:39:32
I use  https://www.petrolprices.com/ (https://www.petrolprices.com/)
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: Old Foxy on 2021-12-04 20:54:11
Petrol prices are also affected by the pound:dollar exchange rate, as oil is priced in USD per barrel.  It is also complicated by the oil company's internal arrangements - exploration & extraction sell to refining, who sell to distribution who sell to retail.  Nothing sinister in this - most big multi nationals operate this way, to minimise their tax burden, but it does make linking pump prices to crude oil prices a lot more complicated.

Like others, I try to shop around and avoid buying at the outlets who are charging sky-high prices. Plenty of other folk go to them, though or they'd be out of business!

Old Foxy
Title: Re: Fuel grade
Post by: davef1uk on 2022-01-11 23:52:31
https://www.bennetts.co.uk/bikesocial/news-and-views/news/2020/march/what-is-e10-fuel-and-is-it-safe